Ms. Lepore, the NYer blogger, has learned the proper way to speak of Poe: treat him like an annoying insect. “Ick” and “liar.” It’s nice that Ms. Lepore feels she can tease Poe, with affection, obviously; that’s nice to see.

She forgot to mention Poe’s enormous influence on cryptography. Cryptographer William Friedman, who was inspired by the Gold Bug, was the unsung hero of the American war effort in World War II. Besides inspiring this particular great man of world history, Poe’s influence helped popularize cryptography. (Poe’s influence on everything else will have to wait for another time.)

Many are called great, but Poe was great. In this sense Poe didn’t play fair. Writers are either making reputations, or dumping on them, but they are often speechless when reputation is wholly beside the point and they have to actually speak of the matter at hand. What can a mere mortal say when confronted with greatness?

When blurbing Poe, we cannot possibly praise enough, so we travel the only way we can: down. “Ick.” “Liar!”

Thomas

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/books/2009/04/solve-edgar-allan-poes-cryptogram.html

“Among the obvious: I know that every human activity consists, one way or another, of battling death.”

Right now, with my words, I am “battling death.”

Tim, by “quietly leaving the room,” is giving into it.

[According to Dubost, ALL human activity consists of 'battling death,' so Tim, by leaving, is 'battling death,' too, which does not invalidate what I have said, so much as show how 'wise words' often reach too far, and by trying to say everything, say nothing.' I am battling not only Tim and death, but Dubost, too, as I heroize myself here with a thousand pardons, of course.]

Note the boast: I (too superior to have an actual discussion) had already left.

This is a sympton of the sickness which exists in poetry today.

The question under discussion: the relationship between speech and verse is absolutely crucial for poets.

If you are 1) not interested in such a discussion 2) unable to bring your own thoughts and feelings to the subject and articulate them in a reasonable, give-and-take manner then, yes, you might as well call it a day, call it quits, ‘quietly leave the room.’

I took the implicit topic of this thread as one that asks: what is an ‘important task’ for a poet, what is a ‘deep’ discussion on poetry? I did make a leap, initially, but the point here is that anyone can get the thread going in a new direction any time they choose. It’s a reactive process. Write ANYTHING and see what others say.

The whole point is that no post, or even series of posts, needs to be taken seriously, at least in terms of getting your own feelings hurt, that is, in terms of the pride of those who are writing them. Unfortunately, there are those who do let their pride and their personal feelings get in the way, and it wouldn’t matter to me if Tim gets all bent out of shape, and it doesn’t matter to me if I’m insulted by Tim (because it doesn’t matter, really, I only pointed out that Tim had insulted me as a pure factual matter) but what happens is that potential participants do not participate because they think, “Oh, dear, feelings have been hurt, and more feelings may be hurt, including my own! if I participate!”

But 1) the risk of getting your feelings hurt ALWAYS exists, even if a thread is bland and polite. You may miss your bus, even though the day is sunny, you may burn the pizza in the oven, or someone may say something on a blog that you don’t like! Heavens!

2) My guess, though, is that if people are now staying away from this thread, it is NOT because of the perceived insults flying between Tim and myself, but for a different reason.

It is rather because Tim made it clear that unless you are well acquainted with the Princeton Encyclopedia, you shouldn’t bother to express yourself, because someone really, really smart may bite you.

Or, that if you cannot tackle the biggest issue in poetry since Wordsworth: how do speech and meter co-exist? and talk about it off the top of your head in a learned, impromptu manner like Thomas Brady, you shouldn’t bother to come around here, either.

It’s impossible to say exactly why all those who are staying away are staying away, for we form opinions quickly and unconsciously, and many, I’m sure, feel that the least hint of a quarrel over a highly intellectual topic is not worth the trouble.

It’s impossible to take a truly informative poll, either. If someone should add to the thread by saying, “Thomas Brady is a twit,” this is no way would be a scientific fact that Thomas Brady is the problem, and I think we need to be scientific on this important issue.

As Gary pointed out, it is the ‘hot and heavy’ threads that get the most posts, and this is because people don’t want to be bored by the sort of bland politeness we find on dust jacket blurbs.

But there’s a reason flattering dust jacket blurbs exist, and they exist for the same reason a car needs motor oil.

But why in the world would a poet want to always dine on motor oil?

That, to me, is the scary thing.

What did I miss about your book?

I thought you already had books out there.

Is this a new one?

Did it win the pulitizer?

How often do *you* consult the Princeton Encyclopedia?

Do you own the New Princeton Encyclopedia or the old one?

Yea, let’s not have a blog. Let’s just email each other. ?????

Do you think it’s fair to run away from a discussion, not to make one reply to what someone has said, and simply say, oh you obviously haven’t read this encyclopedia? R U kidding? That’s not even good manners, much less interesting intellecutal discussion!

Unbelievable! thin-skinned, take-my-ball-and-go-home babies!

Gary, tell me I’m not crazy.

Tell me it’s them!

Thomas

Jeez, I hate typos.

(of course, as my dear wife pointed out, I could always quit posting when I’m loaded)

And I don’t think this is necessarily “tiresome banter”. I just think you guys need to spice it up a little.

Haven’t you ever noticed that that most contentious threads are the most entertaining and end up with the most comments? We need a good old fashioned knock-down, drag-out! Dull is dull but hot is not. Prosody and scansion are dull. Trashing Poe and Ashbery is not.

Pulitzer winner to be announce Monday. Who do you predict?

Any guesses? I predict Franz Wright again for ‘God’s Silence’, or maybe John Ashbery. What do you think?

Further upstream, as the debate raged on, I almost shot off a sarcastic comment to say: “And BTW, guys, thanks anyway for congratulating me on my new book…ya bunch’a twits, ya!”.

But you actually did. You understand how important two years of work that boils down to a lousy 72 pages can be to a poet!

Thank you and bless you.

Gary